SEATTLE — It may have been a story lost in history, if not for the book by Daniel James Brown and the upcoming film directed by George Clooney.
“The Boys In The Boat” tells the true tale of eight poor and working class University of Washington rowers who defied the odds and won gold at the 1936 Olympics, defeating Germany in front of Hitler.
Entertainment reporter Kim Holcomb interviewed Clooney and Brown at Conibear Shell House in Seattle, the home of the current UW Rowing program.
HOLCOMB: "It must be weird for you to be on a set and not directing.”
CLOONEY: “No, no - it's nice.” (laughter)
HOLCOMB: "Daniel, what do you think the boys would think of this shell house?”
BROWN: “I think they'd be blown away by this shell house because the shell house they rode out of, as you know, is a very old airplane hangar and pretty darn rustic."
HOLCOMB: "George, did you secretly come here…”
CLOONEY: “Yes.”
HOLCOMB: “In disguise, to scout things?”
CLOONEY: “Not really in disguise - I was just looking older. People just walk up to you and go, 'You don't look as good as you used to.' (laughter) Yeah, we came here and looked. The only reason we didn't shoot here is because Seattle doesn't look like it did in 1936. We built that exact shell house, literally bolt for bolt. It was just stunning to be in it."
HOLCOMB: "I do love how the book and the movie are a sort of love story to Seattle, and that we as a city were an underdog."
BROWN: "I think it's an essential part of the story. The fact is, in the 1930's, Seattle really wasn't on the national map in a lot of ways. The way the community came together to send them to Berlin I think is for me one of the most touching and important parts of the story."
CLOONEY: "There's an element of this that reminds us that we're all in this together. That our differences aren't all that big and we need to look out for one another, which was a big part of the book. And it was a big driving force in shooting the film, of course, because... your great fear is doing a disservice to his book. That was the most important thing to us was making sure we didn't let Dan down."
HOLCOMB: "It is patently an incredible story. Is it a greater challenge to do justice to a story that is actually incredible?"
BROWN: "My sort of single-minded obsession was, can I do justice to this story as a writer? And it was a huge challenge."
CLOONEY: "If this wasn't a true story, it really would seem stupid. It would seem like we just made it all up. It's all too convenient. Was Hume really sick the day before? Did the coach from Cal really give them some money? Did they really miss the starting gun? All those things just seem like tropes from a made-up story. So there's an advantage to it being real because then you're able to really explore just these huge things they had to overcome."
BROWN: "In terms of writing it, that's part of what was so fun for me, is I kept finding new little nuggets along the way, like when I found out who George Pocock was or I found out just how sick Don Hume was that day... Those were just things that opened up storytelling possibilities, and it doesn't always happen when you're researching a book, that new doors keep opening, but in this case it really did."
HOLCOMB: "From an audience perspective, those races - you had to nail them, right? And you did. As I was watching, I realized I was in the movie theater going like this (rocks forward and back.)
CLOONEY: “You were rowing, you were rowing in your chair.”
HOLCOMB: “Yes. Can you just talk a little bit about the challenges there, just from a technical aspect? You're dealing with light and reflections and movement.
CLOONEY: "I did a movie called ‘A Perfect Storm’ about 30 years ago or something, and I forgot how hard it was to work on the water - water's hard. The wind could blow you off - there's a lot of elements. We're also training actors to row. And even the best rowers can row full speed all day long for maybe a couple of hours, so we don't have a lot of time to shoot them all out, going all out. It's also tricky, it's a little like F1 - if you watch it from any space back, it doesn't feel fast, even though they're flying. It's the same thing with these guys. When we were down next to them, we couldn't keep up with them on the speedboats. The ability to show that was a trick."
HOLCOMB: "We know what the 'swing' means in rowing, finding that perfection and synchronization. Was there a point in your career as a director when you felt like, 'I found my swing?'”
CLOONEY: “No, you're always looking for your swing. You never fully find it. I think that's part of the fun of being in creative arts, is your swing - that'll be something that someone judges long after you're gone. You're constantly in search of how best to tell a story, and every project you do - as an actor, as a writer, as a director - 10 years later you'll look at it and think, 'Well this I could have done better, I wish I'd been better at that.’ I don't know, do you feel the same way?”
BROWN: “Yes, absolutely."
HOLCOMB: "How about catching a crab?”
CLOONEY: “That's a little personal.” (laughter)
BROWN: “Yeah, we don't talk about that.”
CLOONEY: “It was in the army, it was a long time ago." (laughter)
HOLCOMB: "Is there a point in your career where you can identify, 'God, I blew it, but it lead to all of this success'?”
CLOONEY: “Mine are very public. I was in 'Batman and Robin' so I got enough. People just point at that and go, 'Bad.' You learn nothing from success. You really don't. You learn everything from failure, everything. And how you handle it is important, and what you take away from it is important. And I've had tons of that in my career, and in my life."
HOLCOMB: "I thought it was fascinating how the 'adults' in the film were mostly recognizable faces, but the boys were less recognizable - other than Thomas Elms, who looks freakishly like…”
CLOONEY: “Matt Damon - he does, doesn't he?"
HOLCOMB: "Was that a purposeful choice?"
CLOONEY: "Well yeah, I mean we wanted young guys and these were the cheapest ones we could get, really, we go for the cheapest. (laughter) We wanted young, athletic guys. I had to go to them and say, 'Are you athletic?' If they couldn't do it, I said if you can't do it, we're gonna have to fire you. So if you're not athletic, tell me now."
HOLCOMB: "I feel like this is a story that opens people up to the sport of rowing, I learned so much about it from first reading the book - just the taxing nature of it on one's body and things like that. Has it given you a love for rowing that you didn't have before, and have you incorporated any of that into your life in some way? Like, do you have an erg in your home now?”
CLOONEY: “No, no, because I'm 62."
BROWN: "I had zero appreciation for the sport when I started, and zero knowledge, and I've become a big fan. Partly from researching and writing the book, but also from meeting a lot of rowers and coming to really respect just how tough the sport is, how grueling it is, and also the kind of character it builds in rowers. I've met hundreds and hundreds of rowers over the past ten years and there's a kind of common core character they tend to have that is simultaneously very competitive and yet at the same time, very cooperative. They know how to get along with people, they know how to blend into a crew and pull for the other people as much as for themselves."
CLOONEY: "The best teams, it's never really about the individual. I'm a baseball fan, I'm a basketball fan, I'm a football fan. One guy can't do it. Watching that and understanding and appreciating the idea that it's individual achievement attached to everybody else. When you're telling a story, you have to care about all the characters. It's the boys in the boat, not the boy."
HOLCOMB: "There are so many universal themes in this film but it's also very specifically about UW - you even have the fight song, which is a deep cut.”
CLOONEY (singing): “Bow down to Washington... I know it. It adds such color…. We're at a moment where the Huskies are about to go to the playoffs and play on January first and have won these incredible close games and there's a sense of community in Seattle. With the exception of your rain, it's just an elegant, beautiful city and the school and the campus is beautiful. My father, who's still around, was a Depression Era kid, and these guys had to pull together. They couldn't make it otherwise. And you really get the sense in this town and of this community that they did that."
“The Boys In The Boat” is rated PG and opens in theaters December 25.
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